Would you know great teaching if you saw it?


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You're listening to School Leadership Reimagined, episode number 238

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How to builders like us make a dramatic difference in the lives of our students, in spite of all the obstacles we face. How do you keep your vision for your school from being held hostage by resistant teachers, uncooperative parents, ridiculous district policies, or lack of time, money or resources. If you're facing those challenges right now, here's where you'll find the answers strategies, and actionable tips you need to overcome any obstacle you face. You don't have to wait to make a difference in the lives of the people you serve. You can turn your school into a success story right now with the people and resources you already have. Let's get started.

Hey, builders, welcome to another episode of the school leadership reimagined podcast. 

I'm your host, Rob and Jackson. And I want to ask you a question.What do you think when I say this? Any teacher can become a master teacher with the right kind of support and practice. How does that make you feel? What's the what's your first reaction? Well, if you're like a lot of leaders that I've met over the course of my career, your first reaction is rejection. Of course not you. That's not possible. I've met too many teachers who have struggled, some people just shouldn't be teaching. That's the reaction that I typically run across. But the challenge is this, if you're going to get to 100% success, you need master teachers, right. But the definition of a master teacher is a teacher who is able to help every student be successful. 

It's kind of hard to have a vision for 100% success

Unless you also have a vision for every one of your teachers becoming a master teacher. Now when I sit down with people, and I show them how it's possible, and I lay it out, step by step how to do that, how to achieve that. They still don't believe me, even though when we map it out, they see it in front of them, they still don't believe me. And so I really want today to tackle that. Why is it that we don't believe that we might be able to bring ourselves to believe that every child can be successful. But when it comes to the adults in the building, we're sceptical, and I think I've figured out why. So today, I want to talk about why we don't believe it. And hopefully, in doing so I can break the false belief that that that you can't help every teacher become a master teacher. And then over the next series of podcasts, I'm actually going to break it down a little bit further, and explain exactly how you can help every teacher become a master teacher, and it's much simpler than you think it is. 

Let's start out with why people don't believe it. And maybe you too have your doubts, especially if right now you are struggling with a particular teacher, or you have been struggling with that teacher for several years, you may have done everything that you were trained to do, you may have given that teacher feedback you may have given that teacher resources, maybe you had an instructional coach, work with a teacher, maybe you coached the teacher yourself. You might have gone into that teacher's classroom and, and demonstrated lessons, you might have broken things down to what you thought was the simplest, most basic thing. And yet, that teacher is still struggling, that maybe that teacher is struggling because they don't want to get any better. So their struggle is more of a wall problem than the skill problem. They're resistant to your feedback. Maybe that teacher is struggling because even though the receptive to your feedback and your support, they just don't get it and you are frustrated because you're explaining things as best as you can. And they're trying it's just not working and you begin to think maybe they're just not cut out for teaching.

 If you're feeling that way, I get it the way that we were trained to move teachers practice is inefficient and ineffective. 

There I said it. It is because the reason that that we struggle with so many teachers is we are using the things that we wereTrain to use, just don't work. I mean, think about it, when you do something like go and model a lesson without doing the prep work without doing the deep work with the teacher first, then all the teachers really gotten as a glorified sob even if they watch you perform teaching for them, that doesn't translate, let's say that you are giving the teacher resources. And you're when you give a teacher resources, you are making some assumptions about that teacher's ability to digest the resource, and then apply it to their practice. And those assumptions may or may not be true, when you go in and coach a teacher without thinking through where the teacher is and differentiating your coach for that teacher for the level where that teacher is right now, a lot of your coaching goes over the teacher's head.

So basically, you're wasting time because you're coaching teachers at a level that they're not ready for yet. So a lot of how we have been trained to support teachers is in efficient and effective. So it's no wonder, we don't believe that all teachers can become master teachers. Because we've never seen it, it's no wonder that we don't believe that we can significantly impact the practice of any teacher in our building. Because we've tried before, we've worked hard before, and it has never happened. Well, here's what I want to propose to you today.The reason that it's never happened, is because the way that we have been trained to support teachers, isn't designed to help teachers get to mastery.

In fact, the way that we've been trained to support teachers is more about us than it is about the teachers and the kids.

You see, the way we've been trained to support teachers makes us feel like we are doing something we are we we take strategies that we don't fully understand. And we apply it to a teacher. And then we feel like we've done everything we've we could to help the teacher when in fact, we've just been wasting everybody's time. But the strategies that that we are taught to use and that that that fly by night workshop that our district hosted for us at the beginning of the school year where they bought in the guru, and trust me, I used to be the Guru, I used to be the person they brought in, that is not enough to move teachers practice, the big problem is that we are focused on strategies to change teachers practice without really understanding what good instruction is in the first place.

Now, y'all, some people are gonna get mad at me. But I would argue that we don't really understand what good instruction is. And because we don't understand what good instruction is, we can't help people get better at instruction. Until you understand what good instruction is at the fundamental level, you can't help somebody get better at teaching. So what most administrators do is they have a grab bag of strategies that they've been told will work. And they just throw it at a teacher and hope one of them sticks. Or we tell the teacher what worked for us, rather than paying attention and understanding what will work for that teacher. There's a old kind of story. I don't even know if it's true. But the story is there was a senator and he was asked what the definition of porn was. The senator said, I know it when I see it. Well, a lot of us treat effective teaching like porn. We think we'll know it when we see it. But do we really? I know we have evaluation tools and instruments and, and checklists and all kinds of things. And we go into classrooms and we observe teaching.

All we're really doing, we're naming teaching behaviours. 

Did the teacher provision the classroom effectively? Is the teacher asking high level questions? Is the teacher aligning the activities to the standard? Those are teaching behaviours. And then we go and give teachers feedback, where we say, here are the behaviours that I observed. Here are the ones that I didn't see, add those to your practice and stir. And we think that's going to change teachers practice. But again, we're making assumptions about what teachers understand what they can do. And we think that if we just spit our feedback all over teachers, that's enough to move practice. Problem is half of the words that we're spitting out to teachers, we don't truly understand. Do we really understand what alignment is? Do we really understand the principles that undergird provisioning when we talk aboutclassroom climate or routines? Do we really understand why routines are important? And which routines are important? And how teachers can build student ownership over those routines? Or are we just going through our checklist and spitting out this education? Babble as you babbleso that we look smart and that we're hoping that the teachers are able to figure out what we ourselves don't understand and apply it in the classroom.

So we can see something different, according to our instrument.People came in class was all the time they use their instruments, they make up their own instruments, and they still don't have 100% success. Why? Because those instruments are in the way of our understanding of great teaching those instruments, name teaching behaviours, but they don't capture the principles of effective teaching. And so as a result, we don't believe that, that our schools can actually achieve 100% with the people and resources we already have. Because we don't know what to do with the resources and the people we already have. We don't believe that we can achieve 100% success, because we don't really understand what it takes to get there. And as a result, we are performing leadership. But we're not practising builder ship.

So let's take a step back. And let's really understand what good teaching looks like. 

In order to kind of illustrate this, I'm going to tell you a story about when I was a teacher. So when I was a when I first became a teacher, I was a high school English teacher, I taught 11th Grade English I taught some 12th Grade English too. And then I, they, I was I was straddling, and then I went to 11th grade now 11th Grade English was the year that the kids wrote the research paper, and you probably have told me this story again, because it's, it's one of the big epiphanies for me as an educator that happened when I was teaching these kids.

Now, interestingly enough, I, when I did my student teaching, I taught the research paper. And I remember my mentor teacher had a really good system for teaching the research papers, she didn't leave anything up to chance, every aspect of collecting research, understanding research to writing the paper, she kind of had resources, she mapped it out. And before that, as a college student, I learned how to write a research paper, I never been taught really how to think through a paper from start to finish, it was a huge skill. And I remember in freshman composition, learning to write a research paper and loving writing research papers. After that I used to dread them before them. But after that, I loved it, because the system made sense to me. So those two experiences one as a freshman learning to write a research paper, and then as a student teacher, seeing my mentor teacher kind of really unpack and unravel the mystery behind a research paper really impacted me.

So when I, as a teacher began to teach the research paper, I use that knowledge to teach my kids the research paper. But my big problem was this, the moment I said 10 page, research paper, by kids just shut down.I remember a kid once said When I said, Okay, now we're moving to the research paper unit. And we're going to write a 10 page research paper, I remember one kid you say up, well count me out, I've already failed, you might as well give me an F right now. And other kids grown as well. And over the years, we would do things that you know, add more steps to the strategy, break it down even more, you know, taking kids step by step, you can do it, you can do it.

I was working myself to death, my kids were working really hard. 

Every year, there was a large percentage of my kids who just stopped coming to class who just gave up because they just could not believe that they could write a 10 page paper.And I remember sitting down and trying to figure out why weren't my kids successful? Now, if you really think about it, a student who may not be strong in English, English may not be their favourite subject. They're not interested in writing a research paper, most of the research paper topics that we do in school, we try to make them interesting, they're not interesting. So over time, it's just not motivating. They're not motivated to write the paper. They're they, they they may not have the skill set, they need to sustain an idea over 10 pages. They may not have the stamina as a writer, there are all kinds of challenges. And so my question was, how do I make writing a research paper rigorous, but foolproof? Instead of leaving it up to my kids motivation, which may not exist, instead of living up to my kids skill, which again, may not exist?yet, how do I make the process foolproof?

So I remember going in front of my classroom and saying, all right, we're going to write a 10, page 10 Page paper, everybody Oh, you know, people falling out dramatically, kids, you know, kind of tightening up. Nervous, worried no one was excited about it. And I said, Okay, what's the problem? And the kid said, I've never written a 10 page paper before. And I said, Okay, if that makes sense.But have you written a two page paper? And the kid said, Well, I mean, yeah, we write those all the time. I said, Okay, we're going to write five, two page papers. And that's what we did. We took that research paper, we broke it down to its most elemental parts. And the kids turned in two pages at a time I kept them. I gave them feedback.

So every year they're getting better as they progressed to the paper. 

Then I held on to them. And then once they turned in their last paper, and I gone through and given them feedback, I tell the kids, all right, today, we're going to put everything together, I handed them back there five to page papers. And we spent a classroom writing a class period writing paragraphs that were transition paragraphs from one paper to the next. And when we were done, I said, Congratulations, you've just written a 10 page, research paper.I still get goosebumps when I think about it, because the kids would look and they couldn't believe what they had done. They were so shocked. And not only that, the papers were good. It wasn't just 10 pages slapped together, they all had written a 10 page, research paper. And having done so they now felt like, it's easy. Anybody can do it, because they had done it. It was just have to do with you.

Most of you don't believe in your hearts that 100% success is possible.

You might believe it's desirable. Or you might really want it in your heart. But you've never seen it happen before. So you don't believe it's possible. And if you have to rely on the teachers you currently have, you don't believe it's likely to ever happen. Because you can't imagine how you're going to get there with the teachers in front of you.If that's you, I don't condemn you. It's perfectly reasonable. You've never done it before. You've never seen it happen before. So it's reasonable for you to believe that it's not possible.It's a whole we have to do in order to get your school moving. Because, again, if you don't believe it's possible, and and you've never seen it happen, how do you think your teachers feel so when you share this vision with your teachers, they have even less faith in it, because they also don't believe it's possible, they may not have ever experienced it. How many of your teachers have ever experienced having an entire class of students at or above grade level? How many of your teachers have ever really truly experienced having an entire class of students earning nothing below a b minus? Probably never.

So you don't believe it's possible? Because you've never had the experience? Your teachers don't really believe it's possible because they've never had the experience. And both? Both beliefs are absolutely reasonable. Alright, it's not, you're not crazy to think, is this really possible? Because again, you haven't experienced it personally. And you may not know anybody who's experienced it, personally. And even if you did know, someone who has made it happen, or experienced it personally, you might think, well, that person is a unicorn, it can't happen for me, right? So if you're feeling that way, it's totally normal.

The challenge that you have, is you have to, to take, you have to create the belief. 

The thing that keeps people from getting started so often is not that they don't have the will or the skill. They don't have the belief. So just like with my kids who could not believe that they could do a 10 page paper, the way you create the belief is you anchor the belief in something they already have experience something they already do believe something that they already do see as fact. So if you think I can't get to 100% success. Okay, well, you've never experienced that. That's reasonable. Have you ever helped any student be successful? Really? Well? Yeah. I mean, we all have that one student. Have you ever helped a student that everybody else thought was impossible?But you persevered with that student and figured out how to help that student be successful? Yeah. So you've proven that you can do it with one kid. Yeah. All right.
So then let's figure out how to make it happen at scale.

Hey, Robyn here, and I just want to break in real quick to ask you a huge favour. You see, I want to get the word out to everybody about builder ship, and I could use your help. If you're really enjoying this episode. Would you mind just going to your podcast platform and leaving a quick review? You see the reviews get the word out. They tell other people this is a great show other people who have never heard of school leadership reimagined before can hear about it. And you'd be sharing the word about builder ships. So would you mind just leaving a quick review? It would mean the world to me. Okay, now back to the show.

Now, I can believe because I have proof, I have seen it in my own practice. 

Now, what about a teacher who's never had success with one kid? You can say, Have you ever worked hard at anything, and figured it out and found a way to be successful? Anything at all? And the teacher says well being? I mean, nothing school related, alright, with anything? Well, yeah, I did X, Y, and Z. Alright. So then you already know you have the ability to do hard stuff, to persevere, to learn. So all we have to do is channel that same ability in your, into your classroom, into these kids into this work. And we can help you be successful.The first step is to take the thing that feels really big, and chunk it down to something that feels doable in the short term, so that you can build on that. And then once they increase once they do the short term thing, you're creating momentum that now you can have belief in the 100% move.

Several builders and builders should be University who started out with that 100% vision and want to their staffs and their staff said, I want to believe but I don't know that I can do that. I don't know that we're able to do that I want I think it's important, but I've never experienced it. And instead of condemning people and making people feel bad for a perfectly reasonable response to 100%, they just said, alright, what can we do? What what do you feel like we can do that? They don't let people say, Well, I think I can get 80% know what 100% thing can we do? Everything about friends Cena one of our builders and she started with? Well, okay, we she wants 100% of the kids on grade level. And so the first thing she said was okay, well, what can you do? And they said, can you get 100% of your kids to meet their goals? A teacher said, I can do that. And that was her first step. And that was enough to help her school shoot to the top of her district just helping 100% of her kids meet the goals. Once she did that the staff was like, Alright, we've done that. That was easy. We can do 100% of our kids on grade level.That's what you want.

So the same way that at the very beginning.

I took that 10 page paper and I said, All right, let's do it two pages at a time, because you already know how to do a two page paper, you need to think about, okay, if we want 100% of our kids reading? Well, let's start out by thinking about what 100% thing can we do right now? And how do we stack those 100% victories until we get to 100% of our kids reading that are above grade level?Take it, connect it to something that you know you can do do that thing. Now the only thing the only you can't say well, I think we can get to 50% Now you fall into the same trap that you've been in as a leader. It has to be 100%. Right? But you're teaching people how to think and 100% leaps. Okay, so that's the first lesson, find something that they already can do, connect it to that create 100% success there. And then start building 100% success after 100% success until you reach the ultimate vision for 100% success for your students in your vision. Okay, number one. Second lesson from that research paper. I cannot teach kids how to write a research paper unless I truly understood the process. And I broke it down I created packets for them. And I broke down every single step in the process. And I took kids through each step and instead of waiting until the end and having them put it all together to write a research paper. I rewarded every single step.

Alright, so the first thing we have to do is we had to find 10 sources the moment they found 10 sources, we looked over the sources we analyse the sources made sure they were great.

They got 10 points for those 10 sources that 10 points was going to be included in the final research paper page. Pam great, but they got that 10 points, right then in there, you need to do the same thing. What are the steps that it takes to help somebody achieve 100% success? Have you really thought about that, but those of you who aren't be you, you know that we're doing that process as as a part of your one plan. So when you create that one plan, you're breaking it down you you are looking at it and the better your one plan is, the more you understand your one plan, the more you will be able to build your teacher's capacity around achieving that 100% success. But this is the step that most people skip. They say they want 100% success, but then they leave that success up to chance. If you truly want your kids to be successful, you need to understand what it's going to take to help kids be successful. And here's where what I said earlier about great teaching comes into play. Most of the the number one thing to help kids be successful is great teaching.

Most of us don't understand what great teaching is. 

I'm gonna say something that that that may ruffle a few feathers, especially because it's a little controversial, but I'm gonna say it anyway. And then you know, you can fight me later. There are really only seven principles that that you need in order to create 100% success in a classroom of seven principles of effective instruction. Everything else that you do is just a preference.The only seven things you absolutely must have. Everything else is a preference.Now people are gonna say, well, we need PBIS PBIS is a preference. It's a programme, oh, we need to have tier one, tier two, tier three instruction. That configuration is just a framework. It's a preference. You could have no tier one, tier two, three, tier four instruction and still get 100% success.We get stuck on programmes rather than understanding the principles that these programmes capture. If you understood the principles, the programme doesn't matter.And so we overcomplicate success, we overcomplicate instruction, because we layer all these things on top of it, the the the and they're all just preferences. I prefer this framework over this framework to help me achieve my goal. That's it. So instead of burdening teachers down with, oh, our scores on a toilet, so we need this programme, oh, we have to show improvement this year. 

So we need this programme. We are making effective instruction so inefficient, we are but we never give teachers time to learn anything, we throw all these programmes at them. 

We don't even understand why the programme works in the first place. So if you want to be successful, you just need seven things. The first thing is, do your teachers understand the kids in front of them? Do they understand their needs? Do they understand their learning needs? Do they understand their social emotional needs? Do they understand the kids in front of them?Now how you help teachers understand that totally up to you. But if any programme you're using doesn't help teachers truly understand the students in their classroom, waste of time. Second principle. Do your teachers understand where kids are going? Did the teachers really understand what kids need to know and be able to do by the end of the school year? In most cases, in my experience? No, they don't. Andunfortunately, in most cases, neither do you.

So you don't even know where you're trying to get kids. Yeah, you know, the standards. Yeah. You know,we, I get so frustrated with like, people are like, oh, yeah, we unpack the standards. And I'm like, Alright, so what do kids need to know and be able to do and they got to go get a book. And then they show me the book where they circled the nouns and underline the verbs, and they still don't have a fundamental understanding of what it is kids need.They read me the curriculum. They read me the artefacts of the curriculum, but they don't understand what kids need to know and be able to do.Now,I wish that I had time on this podcast to kind of break it down because there's really only five things kids need to know and be able to do.then you layer content over that. So it's very, very simple. When you look at it at its most elemental level, it's not 25 pages and books of stuff, it's five things that kids need to know, be able to do. And it's really around how kids are thinking. And if you can help kids understand that doesn't matter, the content, or the content matters. I'm not saying, like, I'm just saying that those five things go across every content level. So those five things are true and math, reading, science, social studies, gym, cooking, doesn't matter. 

Those five things are elemental. 

So if you can teach kids how to think, and those five ways they can handle any content, and they can handle any test. It's that simple. But do you understand that, but once you understand that, then you I can get you give me any curriculum, and in five minutes, I've got the curriculum, I understand it. I know it. I know. And I also know how to teach it even like, Listen, I'm not a subject matter expert. But if I, if I can look at a curriculum, look at the standard, understand what the standard is asking have kids understand how to teach it, and then you can feed me the content. But that's how you have to understand things in order to be able to achieve 100% success. Do you know that? Do you know how to do that? And if you don't, then it's no wonder you can't help teachers improve? Because you're grabbing at the things that make you feel like you're doing something and you throw that at teachers, but all you're doing is overcomplicating the act of teaching, and preventing people from achieving mastery and teaching. Okay, so do you understand? Do your teachers understand the kids in front of them and their needs? To? Do the teachers in front of you understand where kids are going? Do they understand the standards well enough to be able to understand what the standards are asking of kids so that they can begin to teach kids?

Number three? Do the teachers have the self efficacy do they believe and their ability to teach kids, this is an important one, this one we overlook? You don't see this on anybody's checklist, but it is critical? Do your teachers believe in themselves? Do your teachers have high expectations of themselves. Half of the world problems that are happening in schools right now are because we don't build the efficacy of teachers.So if you just did that, if you just gave teachers some simple tools, you gave them time to get good at those tools, you built their efficacy, then you don't have to worry about motivating people, they're self motivated, because they have efficacy and half the time that the teachers are not doing what I would say more than half of the time, actually, most of the time, but teachers aren't doing what you're asking them to do. It comes down to an issue of your system that teach your asking teachers to follow disincentivizes teachers to follow the system. It doesn't build their own feeling their own sense of efficacy, and as a result, they can't do it. So do your teachers have a sense of efficacy? 

Number four, do your teachers have supports in place throughout the entire learning process to both recognise when kids are struggling, and to help kids quickly get on back and back on track when they do struggle?

It's really simple. Said what we do is we wait till kids fail and then look at the data three months later and start panicking. If you just had an ongoing system of support all the way through if I could see first of all do I do I know what struggle looks like? Do I understand that? And then do I have supports ready for when that happens? Have I anticipated where kids are going to struggle and done things to make success more likely for kids? If I just did that, I could, I wouldn't have kept struggling i and i will get better and better and better at it to the point where my kids wouldn't need the supports at all.

Number 5 am I giving kids feedback that they can use to improve and am I collecting feedback from kids and adjusting my instruction to make sure that I'm better meeting their needs? Number six, do I focus on the most important things that kids need? Or am I just kind of walk working my way through the curriculum and not thinking about the pacing and the quality of the instruction that I'm providing? Then number seven,who's doing the work? Am I doing all the work in the thinking? Or am I building kids capacity to take on more and more ownership over their own learning? That's it. You do those seven things, and all kids are successful.Everything else? Just a preference.So here's what I'm gonna do.Over the next several podcasts, I'm going to break down those seven principles of effective instruction a little bit more, but I'm going to do it from the from the lens of the builder, and talk about why they're important, and why that needs to be our focus. Because if you want to achieve 100%, success, you got to have those seven things in place.But the good news is a, they're only seven.

Once you understand the principles, teachers teaching style, all that other stuff doesn't even matter. 

So teachers are free to teach in ways that that makes sense for them and for their kids. And you don't want to micromanage all of that.And then number three, no matter what the trends are, no matter where the education system is going, no matter where your district is going, these principles will apply. So you can teach them once and build people's capacity in these seven principles once and they will always work no matter what. Which means people have time to get really good at these principles before moving, and then before being asked to move on to something else, they can continually practice these principles. And in fact, the better you get at them, the better you can manage all the other changes that are happening in the district.That's it, seven things.

You know,if I hold up a water bottle,and I hold it up in the air, and then I drop, I let go of the water bottle, what will happen?It drops every time, it doesn't matter if I am motivated or not motivated, it doesn't matter if I want the water bottle to drop, or I don't want the water bottle to drop. It doesn't matter if I have experienced water bottles before or this is the first time I have a water bottle. If I let it go, it will drop. Why? Because of the law of gravity. Gravity works, no matter who is holding the bottle.The same thing is true for the seven principles, they work no matter who is applying them. Which means that they'll work if a teacher isn't motivated, they'll work if a teacher doesn't have a great personality, they'll work if the teacher is new, or the teachers or veteran doesn't matter who's holding the bottle, the principles work. And so if you really want to get to 100%. Number one, you got to make sure that you build the belief. People you have to build people's belief. And a lot of times, buildings keep building people's belief means you have to rely on the experience they've already had, and build that experience and create momentum until they can believe in 100% success. And then number two, you have to really understand what it's going to take to get there and break it down. So that success is inevitable.Anything else leaves success up to chance. 

Over the next few weeks, we'll break this down a little bit more. 

I'm interested in your thoughts, your questions, your yes buts your whereabouts. So meet me at the inside of the school leadership reimagined Facebook group. If you have questions, I'll be in there this week. If you do post your questions in there, and we can continue the conversation in there. And if you want to learn more about the seven principles of effective instruction, or in a book about it, I wrote a book almost 20 years ago and it still applies. It still works. And so the book is called never work harder than your students and other principles of great teaching and you can get it anywhere books are sold. That's it for today. But stay tuned because over the next several weeks, we're going to break down the exact steps it takes to achieve 100% success in every single classroom. Like a builder.

Hey, if you're ready to get started being a builder right away, then I want to invite you to join us at builder ship University.

It's our exclusive online community for builders just like you where you'll be able to get the exact training that you need to turn your school into a success story right now with the people and resources you already have. Inside. You'll find our best online courses, live trainings with me tonnes of resources templates and exemplars and monthly live office hours with me where you can ask me anything and get my help on whatever challenge you're facing right now. If you're tired of hitting obstacle after obstacle and you're sick of tiny little incremental gains each year if you're ready to make a dramatic difference in your school right now that you need to join bill to ship University. Just go to build a ship University dotcalm and get started writing your school success story today.

Hey, this is Robyn, and thanks for listening to the show. Now if you really enjoyed the content, would you do me a favour and share it with somebody else, all you need to do is pull out your phone, click on the little three dots next to the show and you'll see an option there to share the show. Click that and send it to somebody else who could really benefit from what you learned here today. Not only are you going to look like a rock star, but you're going to be helping out somebody else who really could use this information plus, I will be so grateful. So just go ahead right now click on those three dots and share the show. Thanks for listening and I'll see you next time.

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